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	<title>Comments on: David Kirby is out to hunch</title>
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	<link>http://mikestanton.wordpress.com/2007/01/05/david-kirby-is-out-to-hunch/</link>
	<description>Supporting Autistic People</description>
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		<title>By: Deborah</title>
		<link>http://mikestanton.wordpress.com/2007/01/05/david-kirby-is-out-to-hunch/#comment-19503</link>
		<dc:creator>Deborah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Jun 2007 00:29:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mikestanton.wordpress.com/2007/01/05/david-kirby-is-out-to-hunch/#comment-19503</guid>
		<description>I can understand how mercury could have pervasive affects on all areas including the senses but have you considered taste. Yes, taste. Children that acquire autism at 13 months.. have an uncanny unability to eat/accept food--why??? I ask. My theory involves the inability to use saliva as other typical children and the problems involved with gut feeling/accepting food. Taking away the bottle to receive regular milk which is not full of the 100% good stuff cannot help a child that is damaged in this way. My child needed a pure and easy digestive dry calcium drink made. This was given since 13 months so he had no choice but to always accept the norm of taste. He loved it and still enjoys it. It allows for the saliva aspirations that we take for granted. I wish I could take 100 toddlers affected by the damage and test proper milk/distribution in order to show that the immune system is not simple. It involves the importance of how we need to create the norm of salivation and its extreme importance of helping in the progression out of damage to include other invasive...
Just my theory and I have tried it and succeeded with my son. Although he is going to be 8 I feel he is a typical child of 4. Yes, mercury damages. Why would anyone want to put this into the brains of our newborn children???? If I could buy time I would not have vaccinated. I wish you love and hope that someday as a whole we can understand the damage and how to help. There has been so many reports of soldiers damaged by vaccinations--getting diseases/conditions before their time.

It is hard to give love in a different way-- going against what culture believes but I honestly feel that in the long run children can be typical (autism). I still bottle feed at night as his diet (whether it be texture/taste or the problem I have mentioned--damage to salivary production and immune progression). He is healthy, happy and progressing like no other autistic child.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I can understand how mercury could have pervasive affects on all areas including the senses but have you considered taste. Yes, taste. Children that acquire autism at 13 months.. have an uncanny unability to eat/accept food&#8211;why??? I ask. My theory involves the inability to use saliva as other typical children and the problems involved with gut feeling/accepting food. Taking away the bottle to receive regular milk which is not full of the 100% good stuff cannot help a child that is damaged in this way. My child needed a pure and easy digestive dry calcium drink made. This was given since 13 months so he had no choice but to always accept the norm of taste. He loved it and still enjoys it. It allows for the saliva aspirations that we take for granted. I wish I could take 100 toddlers affected by the damage and test proper milk/distribution in order to show that the immune system is not simple. It involves the importance of how we need to create the norm of salivation and its extreme importance of helping in the progression out of damage to include other invasive&#8230;<br />
Just my theory and I have tried it and succeeded with my son. Although he is going to be 8 I feel he is a typical child of 4. Yes, mercury damages. Why would anyone want to put this into the brains of our newborn children???? If I could buy time I would not have vaccinated. I wish you love and hope that someday as a whole we can understand the damage and how to help. There has been so many reports of soldiers damaged by vaccinations&#8211;getting diseases/conditions before their time.</p>
<p>It is hard to give love in a different way&#8211; going against what culture believes but I honestly feel that in the long run children can be typical (autism). I still bottle feed at night as his diet (whether it be texture/taste or the problem I have mentioned&#8211;damage to salivary production and immune progression). He is healthy, happy and progressing like no other autistic child.</p>
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		<title>By: paul f</title>
		<link>http://mikestanton.wordpress.com/2007/01/05/david-kirby-is-out-to-hunch/#comment-9360</link>
		<dc:creator>paul f</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Jan 2007 00:55:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mikestanton.wordpress.com/2007/01/05/david-kirby-is-out-to-hunch/#comment-9360</guid>
		<description>Yeah.  So Kirby is pushing his theory to benefit chelation doctors and class-action lawyers.  Maybe if you represented him accurately it&#039;d be easier to even consider such an accusation.  But your own agenda seems to preclude a fair discussion.

Safe Minds has their own agenda, for sure, but contrary to your claims, Kirby himself has never insisted that the thimerosal hypothesis was correct.  He has always bothered to distinguish between &quot;evidence of harm&quot; and &quot;evidence of proof&quot;. Like many of us, he has seen enough to at least be suspicious, enough to ask for a real dialogue and the opportunity to fund conclusive studies (there have been plenty of flawed studies on both sides of the issue).  He has acknowleged in the past that 2007 would be the year for the numbers to put up (go down) or shut up (stay the same or increase). And he has always suggested that other environmental triggers could be responsible.
 
Here&#039;s something you can read right on his evidenceofharm.com website.  &quot;At the very least, the thimerosal debate has compelled the scientific community, however reluctantly, to consider an environmental component to the disorder, rather than looking for a purely genetic explanation. &quot;  Written in 2004.  And you have the nerve to tell people he&#039;s producing wild new &quot;hunches&quot; this month to bail himself out the thimerosal argument?  

My child lost his language, lost his fine motor skills, which had been excellent, in the months after his vaccines.  We are not convinced that thimerosal is the cause, but we are still wondering.  And although our child is highly self-abusive, has almost no language (now age 9), certainly &quot;low functioning&quot;, we have not trusted chelating or any major biointerventions.  We won&#039;t put him at risk.  But parents deserve honest information and deserve to ask questions.  And in the thimerosal debate, it seems like one side just wants to make the questions go away.  Your selective portrait of Kirby  just reinforces that perception.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yeah.  So Kirby is pushing his theory to benefit chelation doctors and class-action lawyers.  Maybe if you represented him accurately it&#8217;d be easier to even consider such an accusation.  But your own agenda seems to preclude a fair discussion.</p>
<p>Safe Minds has their own agenda, for sure, but contrary to your claims, Kirby himself has never insisted that the thimerosal hypothesis was correct.  He has always bothered to distinguish between &#8220;evidence of harm&#8221; and &#8220;evidence of proof&#8221;. Like many of us, he has seen enough to at least be suspicious, enough to ask for a real dialogue and the opportunity to fund conclusive studies (there have been plenty of flawed studies on both sides of the issue).  He has acknowleged in the past that 2007 would be the year for the numbers to put up (go down) or shut up (stay the same or increase). And he has always suggested that other environmental triggers could be responsible.</p>
<p>Here&#8217;s something you can read right on his evidenceofharm.com website.  &#8220;At the very least, the thimerosal debate has compelled the scientific community, however reluctantly, to consider an environmental component to the disorder, rather than looking for a purely genetic explanation. &#8221;  Written in 2004.  And you have the nerve to tell people he&#8217;s producing wild new &#8220;hunches&#8221; this month to bail himself out the thimerosal argument?  </p>
<p>My child lost his language, lost his fine motor skills, which had been excellent, in the months after his vaccines.  We are not convinced that thimerosal is the cause, but we are still wondering.  And although our child is highly self-abusive, has almost no language (now age 9), certainly &#8220;low functioning&#8221;, we have not trusted chelating or any major biointerventions.  We won&#8217;t put him at risk.  But parents deserve honest information and deserve to ask questions.  And in the thimerosal debate, it seems like one side just wants to make the questions go away.  Your selective portrait of Kirby  just reinforces that perception.</p>
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		<title>By: Mike Stanton</title>
		<link>http://mikestanton.wordpress.com/2007/01/05/david-kirby-is-out-to-hunch/#comment-9354</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Stanton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Jan 2007 22:41:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mikestanton.wordpress.com/2007/01/05/david-kirby-is-out-to-hunch/#comment-9354</guid>
		<description>Paul
Since his book was published Kirby has been an effective front man for campaigns like Safe Minds who argue that there is an epidemic of autism that is directly linked to the increase in thimerosal containing vaccines (TCVs) given to American children in the 1990s. 
When the TCVs were withdrawn it was logical to expect a drop in the number of new cases of autism amongst children if the thimerosal hypothesis was correct. 
When it became obvious that this was not going to happen the thimerosal hypothesis should have died. bu that would have meant the end of the lucrative chelation business and the end of the class action against the vaccine manufacturers.
Instead we have Kirby coming up with new explanations, sorry, &quot;hunches ,&quot; about forest fires, cremations and Chinese power station emissions that conveiently came on stream just as the thimerosal was removed. So the chelating and the lawyering can continue. But there is precious little science to back it up.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Paul<br />
Since his book was published Kirby has been an effective front man for campaigns like Safe Minds who argue that there is an epidemic of autism that is directly linked to the increase in thimerosal containing vaccines (TCVs) given to American children in the 1990s.<br />
When the TCVs were withdrawn it was logical to expect a drop in the number of new cases of autism amongst children if the thimerosal hypothesis was correct.<br />
When it became obvious that this was not going to happen the thimerosal hypothesis should have died. bu that would have meant the end of the lucrative chelation business and the end of the class action against the vaccine manufacturers.<br />
Instead we have Kirby coming up with new explanations, sorry, &#8220;hunches ,&#8221; about forest fires, cremations and Chinese power station emissions that conveiently came on stream just as the thimerosal was removed. So the chelating and the lawyering can continue. But there is precious little science to back it up.</p>
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		<title>By: paul f</title>
		<link>http://mikestanton.wordpress.com/2007/01/05/david-kirby-is-out-to-hunch/#comment-9332</link>
		<dc:creator>paul f</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Jan 2007 18:07:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mikestanton.wordpress.com/2007/01/05/david-kirby-is-out-to-hunch/#comment-9332</guid>
		<description>&quot;immediately afterward&quot; Kirby said:

Mercury remains a logical candidate for contributing to &quot;autism spectrum disorders,&quot; either alone or in combination with other environmental insults. Mercury exposure can kill brain cells. It can cause loss of speech and eye contact, digestive and immune dysfunction, social withdrawal and anxiety, and repetitive and self-injurious behaviors.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;immediately afterward&#8221; Kirby said:</p>
<p>Mercury remains a logical candidate for contributing to &#8220;autism spectrum disorders,&#8221; either alone or in combination with other environmental insults. Mercury exposure can kill brain cells. It can cause loss of speech and eye contact, digestive and immune dysfunction, social withdrawal and anxiety, and repetitive and self-injurious behaviors.</p>
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		<title>By: paul f</title>
		<link>http://mikestanton.wordpress.com/2007/01/05/david-kirby-is-out-to-hunch/#comment-9331</link>
		<dc:creator>paul f</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Jan 2007 18:05:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mikestanton.wordpress.com/2007/01/05/david-kirby-is-out-to-hunch/#comment-9331</guid>
		<description>Incredible that you base entire posts on the concept that Kirby is &quot;recanting&quot; on a selective quote about other potential environmental insults.  What about what he said immediately afterward?  
&gt;
I don&#039;t have a determined position on the mercury issue; I&#039;d like to know the answer but it&#039;s hard to find unbiased analysis.  You can continue to attack Kirby&#039;s credibility, but you&#039;re obviously no better.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Incredible that you base entire posts on the concept that Kirby is &#8220;recanting&#8221; on a selective quote about other potential environmental insults.  What about what he said immediately afterward?<br />
&gt;<br />
I don&#8217;t have a determined position on the mercury issue; I&#8217;d like to know the answer but it&#8217;s hard to find unbiased analysis.  You can continue to attack Kirby&#8217;s credibility, but you&#8217;re obviously no better.</p>
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		<title>By: Mike Stanton</title>
		<link>http://mikestanton.wordpress.com/2007/01/05/david-kirby-is-out-to-hunch/#comment-8103</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Stanton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 07 Jan 2007 15:31:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mikestanton.wordpress.com/2007/01/05/david-kirby-is-out-to-hunch/#comment-8103</guid>
		<description>Hi Bill
the poblem I have is with the anti vaxers who claim that there is an autism epidemic in which nearly all of the increase is regressive autism caused by vaccines. Moreover this regressive autism  of theirs is presented in the media as an unremitting nightmare of screaming, shit smearing, violent children who have lost all social and language skills. I do not doubt that there are children like this. But they are not typical of the vast majority of autistic children, regressive or otherwise. 

Regressive auism is real. Studies of family videos and detailed questionnaires of parents have identified at least three groups - early onset autism, regressive autism after normal develpment and regressive autism after atypical development. These studies relied on very small sample sizes and cannot give prevalence data. One estimate by Professor Gillberg is that maybe 20 per cent of autism is regressive. 

The problems with parental bias are not a slur on parents. It is a real psychological phenomenon. The publicity around MMR did change parental perceptions. They were not making it up. They were reinterpreting the past in a way that made sense at the time. 

I think the real problem, Bill, is with the anti-vaxers hijacking the concept of regressive autism for their own ends. It is their antics that might lead to you all being tarred with the same brush. 

I think you will find that their negative effect far outweighs any possible good that might arise from raising legitimate points about autism. And they are not the only ones raising these points. A lot of us in the other camp are concerned that legitimate health concerns and standards of care for autistic children and adults are not being properly addressed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Bill<br />
the poblem I have is with the anti vaxers who claim that there is an autism epidemic in which nearly all of the increase is regressive autism caused by vaccines. Moreover this regressive autism  of theirs is presented in the media as an unremitting nightmare of screaming, shit smearing, violent children who have lost all social and language skills. I do not doubt that there are children like this. But they are not typical of the vast majority of autistic children, regressive or otherwise. </p>
<p>Regressive auism is real. Studies of family videos and detailed questionnaires of parents have identified at least three groups &#8211; early onset autism, regressive autism after normal develpment and regressive autism after atypical development. These studies relied on very small sample sizes and cannot give prevalence data. One estimate by Professor Gillberg is that maybe 20 per cent of autism is regressive. </p>
<p>The problems with parental bias are not a slur on parents. It is a real psychological phenomenon. The publicity around MMR did change parental perceptions. They were not making it up. They were reinterpreting the past in a way that made sense at the time. </p>
<p>I think the real problem, Bill, is with the anti-vaxers hijacking the concept of regressive autism for their own ends. It is their antics that might lead to you all being tarred with the same brush. </p>
<p>I think you will find that their negative effect far outweighs any possible good that might arise from raising legitimate points about autism. And they are not the only ones raising these points. A lot of us in the other camp are concerned that legitimate health concerns and standards of care for autistic children and adults are not being properly addressed.</p>
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		<title>By: livsparents</title>
		<link>http://mikestanton.wordpress.com/2007/01/05/david-kirby-is-out-to-hunch/#comment-8047</link>
		<dc:creator>livsparents</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Jan 2007 21:40:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mikestanton.wordpress.com/2007/01/05/david-kirby-is-out-to-hunch/#comment-8047</guid>
		<description>I think that dismissing regressive autism as just a figment of the parents imagination (imagination of a larger pocketbook if I read the implication correctly) or lack of observation skills is doing a disservice to those of us in the .00017% pecentile (thanks for the # Joseph).  Looks insignificant, but would probably be something in the neighborhood of 3-5% of the autistic population.  I guess we should just lump those Retts people in there too, and any other &#039;legitimate&#039; disorder that mirrors autism.  Just a little piece of the whole pie...
I understand the point they were making in the past that the regressive form of autism was not increasing was the point, I agree.  But  your bullet in the blog just serves to &#039;cheapen&#039; the potential legitimate 3-5% of us; I&#039;m just an ignorant or worse money hungry parent is the impression I get of myself based on your bullet.

I won&#039;t attempt to defend Kirby.  The only thing I can say about him and others on that side of the fence is they bring out some of the legitimate points about the autistic condition, then draw questionable conclusions about causation.  Just like a  man named Al Sharpton here in the states: I disagree with probably 90% of the conclusions he draws, but what he is fighting about are valid point and should be listened to...
Bill</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think that dismissing regressive autism as just a figment of the parents imagination (imagination of a larger pocketbook if I read the implication correctly) or lack of observation skills is doing a disservice to those of us in the .00017% pecentile (thanks for the # Joseph).  Looks insignificant, but would probably be something in the neighborhood of 3-5% of the autistic population.  I guess we should just lump those Retts people in there too, and any other &#8216;legitimate&#8217; disorder that mirrors autism.  Just a little piece of the whole pie&#8230;<br />
I understand the point they were making in the past that the regressive form of autism was not increasing was the point, I agree.  But  your bullet in the blog just serves to &#8216;cheapen&#8217; the potential legitimate 3-5% of us; I&#8217;m just an ignorant or worse money hungry parent is the impression I get of myself based on your bullet.</p>
<p>I won&#8217;t attempt to defend Kirby.  The only thing I can say about him and others on that side of the fence is they bring out some of the legitimate points about the autistic condition, then draw questionable conclusions about causation.  Just like a  man named Al Sharpton here in the states: I disagree with probably 90% of the conclusions he draws, but what he is fighting about are valid point and should be listened to&#8230;<br />
Bill</p>
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		<title>By: notmercury</title>
		<link>http://mikestanton.wordpress.com/2007/01/05/david-kirby-is-out-to-hunch/#comment-7984</link>
		<dc:creator>notmercury</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Jan 2007 01:54:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mikestanton.wordpress.com/2007/01/05/david-kirby-is-out-to-hunch/#comment-7984</guid>
		<description>Nice Job Mike, 
I finally found the time to read your post properly and I&#039;m so glad you addressed Kirby&#039;s list point by point. Clearly Mr. Kirby is more interested in generating controversy and book sales than fact checking. What a fine journalist he is.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nice Job Mike,<br />
I finally found the time to read your post properly and I&#8217;m so glad you addressed Kirby&#8217;s list point by point. Clearly Mr. Kirby is more interested in generating controversy and book sales than fact checking. What a fine journalist he is.</p>
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		<title>By: Ms. Clark</title>
		<link>http://mikestanton.wordpress.com/2007/01/05/david-kirby-is-out-to-hunch/#comment-7971</link>
		<dc:creator>Ms. Clark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Jan 2007 20:43:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mikestanton.wordpress.com/2007/01/05/david-kirby-is-out-to-hunch/#comment-7971</guid>
		<description>CDD is happens after 3 years of age and I have read that it can be very sudden and includes a kind of panicky behavior on the part of the kid.  The regression is more drastic and the loss of skills more permanent than in  &quot;regressive&quot; autism.
http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/001535.htm

Autistic kids don&#039;t usually lose the ability to walk or move their arms, that sort of thing. Maybe they never do, but CDD kids do, to some degree.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>CDD is happens after 3 years of age and I have read that it can be very sudden and includes a kind of panicky behavior on the part of the kid.  The regression is more drastic and the loss of skills more permanent than in  &#8220;regressive&#8221; autism.<br />
<a href="http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/001535.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/001535.htm</a></p>
<p>Autistic kids don&#8217;t usually lose the ability to walk or move their arms, that sort of thing. Maybe they never do, but CDD kids do, to some degree.</p>
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		<title>By: Joseph</title>
		<link>http://mikestanton.wordpress.com/2007/01/05/david-kirby-is-out-to-hunch/#comment-7966</link>
		<dc:creator>Joseph</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Jan 2007 15:06:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mikestanton.wordpress.com/2007/01/05/david-kirby-is-out-to-hunch/#comment-7966</guid>
		<description>Why is John going by Jack now?

BTW, truly regressive autism, which is called CDD, is very rare. Its prevalence is estimated at around 1.7 in 10,000.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why is John going by Jack now?</p>
<p>BTW, truly regressive autism, which is called CDD, is very rare. Its prevalence is estimated at around 1.7 in 10,000.</p>
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